Discussion about facebooks policies which discriminate against women

Discussion about facebook policies, which discriminate against women.

''If you don't like it, why use it?''
If you don't like it, why use it?
By Tom Hamer

'' if you don't know what you're talking about, why post? do a little reading, bro. you're way behind. of course, I wouldn't expect a white man to know the first thing about hate speech and censorship. two words: MALE PRIVILEGE. -Kaitlyn Newton''
By Kaitlyn Newton

'' I did not mean any offence, but it is a free service and he and his company have no obligations to bow to every complaint, so I reiterate, why use it?''
By Tom Hamer

 It is not a free service. It is paid for with advertising. And, what many of us are objecting to is that women are being exploited in the worst way possible to attract traffic. ie We question why pages which promote violence against women are allowed to remain on facebook.

Is it because these sick pages attract traffic and thus more add revenue? And, why are photos of women breast feeding removed? Because they don't attract add revenue? We are not willing to be exploited in this way, for the sake of increasing add revenue for facebook. Also, even if the service was free, we would still object to an environment which exploits women in this way. ie If something promotes violence against women, it should concern all socially conscious women, and men too.
By Me

Guess which of these photos facebook bans.

https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=144537045742920&set=a.12417866

''Women/men on Facebook close down your account for 24 hours in protest to Facebook´s lack of action when it comes to removing rape pages, images and rape- and violence jokes against women.
Facebook is sending out the message that it is ok to rape and, degrade girls and women, but the female body and breastfeeding is offensive and needs to be censored.
We are saying NO to this and closing our account for 24 hours''

This protest is by the following group.
https://www.facebook.com/events/260737404066242/?notif_t=plan_user_invited

This discussion took place on the following facebook page.
https://www.facebook.com/pages/Mark-Zuckerberg-supports-sexual-violence-against-women/234334396691437
__________________________

Follow or page 'Rapebook' aka 'StopRapebook' on Twitter. 

https://twitter.com/StopRapebook

Our facebook page. 

https://www.facebook.com/StopRapebook

___________________________

 ”Thanks for being part of ending gender-based hate speech on Facebook!” Join us in our next stage of protest, to help make sure facebook upholds their agreement to remove content which promotes violence against women and girls. Please, report as follows and then send an email to the email addresses as appropriate. That will help us keep track of whether facebook is taking steps to keep itself clean of this type of abuse, as they said they would during or recent protest. ”It’s important to note that our campaign and Facebook’s commitment specifically address content that glorifies, promotes or makes light of violence against women and girls. : : So, depending on what you have to report, here’s how to do it: For content that glorifies, promotes or makes light of violence against women and girls: First, report it to Facebook using their standard reporting system. If the content has been reported and Facebook has declined to remove it, email us, and we’ll take further action. Please include any information you have about when and how you reported the content, and what response(s) you’ve received from Facebook.” Fromhttp://www.womenactionmedia.org/facebookaction/how-to-report-gender-based-hate-speech-to-facebook/

BONER Busters (aka Bra Busters)

''so you make people like a page thinking it's one thing then go around changing it into a feminist group.
False misleading advertising and discrimination against men who enjoy a view every now and then.
this is not the way to ''stop'' anything, it just makes feminism look even worse in the eyes of the men they constantly want to fight. Just let people do or be what they want to be. Who are you to tell us what we do is wrong?''
By Jarell Mackey, supporter of facebook page 'Bra Busters'

Why do some people expect us to actually sell feminism to them, as if it is some kind of commodity that we have to market, rather than about our need and right to equality? Don't we have enough to deal with, coping with the strain an unfair world puts on us, without also having to take responsibility for the guilt, anger and other negative emotions that come up in others, when we talk about it. We simply can't make something as ugly as the hate, oppression, discrimination against us look nice enough for those who wonder why we can't make it look more user friendly.
Post by me, in response to Jarell Mackey

BONER Busters

BONER Busters was formerly 'Bra Busters', which used to be a men's page. 

For some reason, the admin of the men's page asked a radical feminist if she would be an admin of the page, in the name of adding more variety or something. She accepted the offer, and them promptly threw him off the page, removed the porn and posted feminist slogans. 

Furious reactions from the page members ensued, until many feminists joined the page.

 Since then, the page has been under constant attack by the so called men's rights pages. Facebook unpublished the page, because of the many reports that the page has hate speech and the page has porn on it.

 ''“This is the story of a feminist takeover,” wrote the author of Feminist at Sea, a Wordpress blog.'' 
 From http://www.dailydot.com/society/bra-busters-facebook-porn-feminist-takeover/

 Blog by me, on facebook censorship
http://blogsbymelissaflaherty.blogspot.de/2013/06/facebooks-strange-selective-censorship.html

Support BONER Busters (aka Bra Busters)

Here's how

http://feministadminssupport.blogspot.de/2013/06/bra-busters-page-removed-by-facebook.html?zx=a9bd733df106a0e6

Hey girls!, and others

We are not all Man Mankind, Mrs His Name and whatever other degrading descriptions can be put on us to turn us into side kicks of the human race which are entitled to less that Man is. We have a right to respect in language, as well as everything else.

By me, on a comment made by Monica Wallis, in response to my objection to us all being masculinised  by default.

'' I'm personally okay with the "hey guys" thing'' - You shouldn't be. It censors women out of the written and spoken word, in the same way as calling everybody man does. It is no accident, that these words which are supposed to be gender neutral are the masculine words. People really have no idea how much this actually affects the human psychology of how women are seen.

By Monica Wallis

I realize it with almost all other terminology (it's the reason I named my fb page "Omigawdess"), but for some reason 'guys' doesn't rub me the way everything else does. in an ideal world it wouldn't be normalized, because gender either wouldn't exist or we'd have an actual unisex term, but I'm still going to pick and choose the battles that I want to fight as a feminist. Guys doesn't really bother me as much as man, mankind, and God. Maybe because guys is more of a slang to being with.

By me

Guys is the modern version of Man, Mankind..., and this is far from an ideal world.

By me, on a comment made by Lillsa Graham

 '' better than "hey bitches", that shit i'm tired of.'' - Well yeah, worse situation for everything can always be found...

By me, on a comment made by Monica Wallis

 '' I call all misogynists assholes, be they male or female'' - You should also start putting this lists in alphabetical order, rather than sticking with certain conventions.

By me, on a comment made by Monica Wallis

''I wasn't sticking with convention. I was putting it in order of misogynist blame.'' - I say though, if you do that, it needs to be done along with a statement, if it is to have some effect, because people are generally unaware of subtle forms of sexism, and don't feel blamed at all, if somebody responds to them, using the same subtle forms of sexism. 

By me, on a comment made by Monica Wallis

You took my comment out of context. I was expressing a personal difference in visceral reaction to "hey guys" vs "man" "mankind" "The Lord" and "His Will" etc. I agree about gendered terms. I don't see why a need for a separate thread picking out my comment, but anyways.

By me

 '' I don't see why a need for a separate thread picking out my comment'' - Because, I was in the process of updating my blog, with my responses, to more the usual comments people make about this topic, and I wanted to make a discussion to see what more comes up. 

As well at that, comments made in public belong to the public. Some forget that, when posting on the internet. And, anything which can negatively affect women will concern feminist activists and they WILL respond to it. 

Your visceral reaction: Feminism is more about what affects the needs, rights, autonomy... of half the world's population, rather than how traumatized any particular individual currently is or isn't, about any aspect of the oppression. All sexism is serious, and all of it negatively impacts women.


By somebody else, somewhere else

We miss you guys

My comment

Hey girl!
Can we all be girls, instead of guys?

Discussion comments, from the following facebook page. 
https://www.facebook.com/groups/395416773902785/397555543688908/?notif_t=group_comment_reply

What is wrong with sexist language? Read this blog.

http://thegirlgod.blogspot.de/2013/06/sexist-language-matters-heres-why.html

Masculinising all positive personal characteristics by default is part of systematic oppression, and it is more powerful that many realize. Words matter!
Dick swinging
Man up
Have the balls
Wear the trousers

'' Language is a powerful tool that we take for granted as benign; however, it is anything but.  Language has a profound effect on our brains.''
From http://shehasthepower.wordpress.com/2013/06/24/surviving-the-agent/


Is there an email address or something, to contact Google?

One thing facebook actually did right, a long time ago when they used to do things right was list gender as Female Male, as it should be, because that is alphabetical order, on the form for users of the site to fill in their details, unlike Google who are using the conventional Male first order. I think, now that some are changing, Google + should be prompted in that direction too.

As well as that, they should lose the 'maiden name' option, since there isn't even a word for men's former names if they change their name to hers on getting married. Considering this, I think Google is contributing to the pressure women are under to follow accepted customs which reduce their identity and visibility.

Facebooks strange selective censorship strikes again, to silence women.

Following is a blog made by an admin of facebook page 'Rapebook', in support of facebook page 'Bra Busters'. 

http://feministadminssupport.blogspot.de/2013/06/bra-busters-page-removed-by-facebook.html?zx=d5bb14419aa4f2fa

Here are a couple of blogs I wrote a number of months ago, detailing this ongoing problem. See also the blog comments.

http://www.travelblog.org/Europe/Germany/Bavaria/Munich/blog-754652.html

http://www.travelblog.org/Europe/Germany/Bavaria/Munich/blog-758181.html

Comment by Nathan Palmer, and reply by me, on the facebook page 'Boner Busters'

Nathan Palmer

You can't really believe Facebook just deletes people to "censor women", can you?

Me

No Nathan, I don't believe it is exactly like that.

 This is the real problem with things like discrimination and psychological violence. It is based on real ignorance. And, the real problem with ignorance is that when people are ignorant, they are generally unaware of it, which makes it a difficult problem to solve. Shedding light on the situation, such as people like me are doing is one way of initiating the thought, that there is in fact a problem which needs to be solved.

Nathan Palmer

 I think you are over-analyzing it though. People get deleted for bad reasons (or no reason?) all the time. ESPECIALLY groups or pages. All it takes is to get reported by a number of people. It is not censorship on women. In other words, I don't think there is light to be shed on the situation here.

Me

 I don't you can over analyze something which effects half the world's population. It is important to address every aspect of what affects the lives and human rights of so many people. Gender discrimination has real affects.

 Yes, you are right about the fact that discrimination does not just censor women. It can target others too, including all those who bump the status quo.

Who are Anonymous?

So, according to this video Anonymous is not a person, but an idea. Yet, there are a lot of people on facebook(and perhaps on other internet sites) wearing masks and saying they are Anonymous.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OV7rIZ9laag&sns=fb

Does an idea wear a mask? For sure, there is an idea in there somewhere, of public do gooding, but one has to wonder how often this idea counts with those who say they are Anonymous, and how often the Anonymous mask is used by cyber stalkers, other bullies, and even rapists as this video is also demonstrating. Is it the same people behind the mask who are do gooding, as the ones who are doing evil?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OV7rIZ9laag&sns=fb

Because, nobody is a cruel as Anonymous is...

http://www.travelblog.org/Europe/Germany/Bavaria/Munich/blog-785841.html

 Is Anonymous still attacking feminists?

Text from a private message I received:

Text from a private message I received:

 ''Hi, I'm reading it right now. Is this still going on? this article is dated a few years back.''

Yes, it is still going on. It happened to me, just a couple of months ago. 

Here are some of the blogs I made about it. 

http://www.travelblog.org/Europe/Germany/Bavaria/Munich/blog-786282.html

Here is another blog I made a couple of months ago. I didn't specifically mention Anonymous in this blog, because there was more than one group attacking us. A lot of them did say they were from Anonymous.

http://www.travelblog.org/Europe/Germany/Bavaria/Munich/blog-776385.html

This is the article being referred to in the text from the private message above. - ''Then I got word that a loosely organized cybermob known as Anonymous was attempting to crash feminist sites, including Feministe, flooding comments sections with misogynist rants and threatening feminist bloggers with rape and other violence. This had happened before, but never with such organized force.''
http://bitchmagazine.org/article/from-the-archive-wack-attack

Unmasking the evil

See the following link. Also, note that Rapebook is not a hate page. It is a page which raises awareness about hate speech, particularly hate speech against women, such as rape jokes, and jokes about domestic violence. Would those who are concerned about women's safety put women's contact details on the open internet like what you have done, Anonymous? 

FYI: We(the admins of 'rapebook') have had the Dox linked to in the post Anonymous made on their facebook page, removed from the internet. It contained our real names, addresses and phone numbers, which whoever made the dox found via a combination of Googling, and tricking people into giving out by methods such as making clones of our facebook account to pretend to be us, and tricking people into giving information out about us, or at least this is how we guess they got the information about us.
http://www.travelblog.org/Photos/7518838

The following was said, on a discussion between me and a guy who wrote a book about Anonymous. The book is called 'Hackers on Steroids'

http://www.amazon.com/Hackers-on-Steroids-ebook/dp/B00BEPTP4C/

By me

• What really freaks me out about Anonymous, is the sudden appearance of women in prominent positions with Anonymous. The voice on that video is female, and that makes me feel more manipulated than reassured. It might be a bit far fetched, but I am guessing it is happening because they want to reap some of the popularity that feminism is currently gaining with even people like Madonna and Boyence supporting it, and with there being growing numbers of large feminist pages on facebook. Now, a feminist section of Anonymous seems to have sprung up. What makes me doubt their sincerity where feminism is concerned is the very severely to abusive macho atmosphere on their facebook pages and groups. Also, the frequent use of words like fag, faggot.... by their admins on facebook and their followers leads me to believe that they don't have an inclusive attitude towards women or other minorities either. 
  
  Part of a discussion between me, and somebody calling themself Anonymous. The page name is 'The War on Ignorance' and this person is an admin on that page. I didn't know that this is yet another huge page owned by folks calling themselves Anonymous. They seem to be everywhere.
  
  Me
  No, I am not butthurt, as you put it. When one receives death threats, has been doxed, has had horrific images of rape and domestic violence posted on ones timeline, had ones page invaded by thousands of troll posts, one starts to believe that one must spread awareness about what is going on, as it is a public health and safety issue. People need to become aware of what those calling themselves Anonymous on facebook are doing. Yes, I know that not everyone wants to listen... - Unliking from your page. Anyone who uses words like butthurt, is in no way a supporter of any 'war on ignorance', and I am not supporter of people who troll at their page supporters.
  
  'The War on Ignorance' page admin
  It has nothing to do with Anonymous News Network. I am Anonymous. You could be too to and start a "FeminOp" if you wanted to.. unfortunately, you don't know the first thing about anonymous.
  
  Me
  You are Anonymous? Well, that explains your attitude, you troll.
  ''You could be too to and start a "FeminOp"''
  You have to be kidding! I don't join people who threaten to kill me and rape me, who dox me, and who troll all over my facebook page which is for supporting women rights. I, unlike you don't need to join a mob. I speak for myself.
  ''...unfortunately, you don't know the first thing about anonymous.''
  What I do know, is that the nutcases calling themselves Anonymous on facebook have nothing at all to do with what Anonymous is supposed to stand for.
  
  'The War on Ignorance' page admin
  I am an individual. The anonymous ops I find valuable to society and my goals I will participate in. You really do not know the first thing about anonymous. Anonymous is not "supposed" to stand for anything..
  
  Me
  Here on facebook Anonymous seems to stand for just about everything. It claims to fight paedophiles, and it also promotes hate against oppressed groups such as women.
  
  'The War on Ignorance' page admin
  We are not anonymous news network. Stop attacking them here.
  
  Me
  I am posting about what happened on my facebook page, which is a page to support womens rights. My page and it's admins were attacked by hundreds of trolls calling themselves Anonymous and wearing masks, just like the one the photo on your meme here. They threatened our page and our page admins and posted our personal details and our kids personal details on the internet. They are evil people and you should not object to me using your page to warn people about them, as at least a warning might keep some people safe and make them aware that no matter who somebody says they are, they should not automatically be trusted when they are strangers. Facebook is NOT a safe place and people should be aware of how careful they need to be.

  
  
• 
  

By the author

''It's a computer-generated voice though, Anonymous videos are always made with computer-generated voices. Mostly the whole thing is a fantasy of power and rebellion, and for the most part nothing but a joke (except to the Anons, who take it deadly seriously).''

By the author

Anyone can be 'Anonymous' and some very evil and pathetic people are within its 'ranks' (as well as some decent people, to be fair - and many, MANY nutters!). My book aims to help people understand just exactly what the whole Anonymous thing is and how it grew out of trolling on the psychos playground of 4Chan.org

By me

 ''...just exactly what the whole Anonymous thing is and how it grew out of trolling on the psychos playground of 4Chan.org:'' - Looks like you observed the same as I did. Here is another discussion between me and some other admin on another massive Anonymous page. - Soon after I replied to the admins questions, my replies disappeared. 

Anonymous Oklahoma*sigh* Melissa Flaherty Why would you make 4 comments that are totally unrelated to the topic of a post about helping tornado victims? I can't help but get the feeling you are a little coo coo, or some kind of wannabe troll. I'll give you a few hours to make a case for not having your crap deleted and account banned. tick tock
Like · Reply · 25 minutes ago

Melissa Flaherty One has to wonder how you can reconcile the cyber mobbing Anonymous does, with the shows of do gooding you put on. I have been told that your massive hate pages are for the purpose of catching pedophiles, and that you attacked our page which is against hate speech, for the purpose of protecting free speech, and the free speech you were protecting is in the form of rape jokes and jokes about domestic violence. A little coo coo eh? I am sick and tired of cyber mobbing, by people like Anonymous, 4chan etc more like. - '' I'll give you a few hours to make a case for not having your crap deleted and account banned. tick tock'' Well, Anonymous and a bunch of other massive hate groups already tried bring down our facebook page and terrorized our admins. In that light, deleting what I am posting here on this discussion hardly matters at all. - Seems to me that the real purpose of the do gooding you say you do is to cover up the other sick behavior that Anonymous is up to on facebook. Read the blogs in posts I made here, if you want to know what I am talking about.
Like · 10 minutes ago

Melissa Flaherty Check out this screen shot, of one of your folks inciting attacks against our page, and posting our personal details in a dox on the open internet and tell me who is a little coo coo. As well as that, one has to wonder where Anonymous came up with those horrific photos of women being raped, that they posted on our timeline. It is horrifying to think about. And, what were those attempts to hack our admin accounts about? You wanted to hack into a page which is against misogyny, for what reason? Do you think that women should not run pages to support women's rights? That is not just coo coo, that is evil.http://www.travelblog.org/Photos/7518838

Melissa Flaherty Rape jokes are not free speech. Unless you are more than a little coo coo yourself, you should be disgusted by the types of jokes the following news article shows. This is the type of free speech your massive hate mob attacked us for objecting to. -
http://thinkprogress.org/health/2013/05/22/2046491/facebook-violence-against-women-

By the author

Yeah they are a strange 'group', although really they are just a culture and not a group and not all 'Anons' follow the same moral (or immoral) codes or attack the same targets. Too many though are pathetic creatures like the 7-stone scarecrow-like Anonymous leader Malcolm Blackman (45 years of age!) who are in it for some ludicrous fantasy of power that they otherwise would never be able to indulge themselves with. To them they are the Internet's Mafia and just as dangerous, which is so pathetic it makes me want to weep for them.

In fairness though some are decent sorts who are trying to do genuine good esp in relation to child abuse, although why they attach themselves to the culture of Anonymous I don't know.

By me

''...although why they attach themselves to the culture of Anonymous I don't know.'' - Maybe some lose prospective, when their fight against pedophiles does not seem to be as successful as they want it to be. Also, I think, some of them might be afraid of Anonymous, so conveniently believe they are what they  hope they are, otherwise they will get what our page(Rapebook) got. Some ''friends'' of Anonymous tried to warn me off reporting hate speech which was on pages owned by Anonymous. Some said, they were warning me for my own good. Others said, I am to stop reporting the hate pages, because the hate pages are to catch pedophiles. I am not sure how rape jokes and other hate speech can be used to catch pedophiles.

http://www.amazon.com/Hackers-on-Steroids-ebook/dp/B00BEPTP4C/

I received the following response, about my blog. It is a typical response by those calling themselves Anonymous on facebook. Liberal use of the words butthurt and fag make up most of their replies to my points about what many who are using the name Anonymous are really doing.

 Anonymous News Network: No one cares. You are clueless and butthurt over nothing. Hush.